Misunderstanding UTAU

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    hello8bit

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    Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by hello8bit on Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:04 pm

    My friend at school believes than in order to create an UTAU, you just need to add a simple TPain effect to your voice and that's it. This bothers me because of how much work one has to do in order to make a voicebank-- let alone a GOOD voicebank. Sure, autotune isn't bad, and it's not always easy, but it isn't the same as UTAU.

    Even if they both modify your voice, they are done in different ways. This is how I see it: Creating a piece of art. You can do it via paints, or you can do it with clay. Both mediums have the purpose of creating an image, but one is a painting and one is a sculpture. They aren't the same, though they have similar purposes. Disagree with me if you wish, but these are my views.

    I just wish people would really try to understand the effort and time we put into our UTAU hobby. And maybe do a little research before making assumptions.


    Last edited by hello8bit on Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:12 pm; edited 2 times in total

    Haloheroine
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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by Haloheroine on Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:29 pm

    Lol.
    Not Autotune lol.
    Not at all. Completely different.

    T-Pain effect adds some random pitches to the start of notes.

    UTAU lets you create a song from scratch.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by LeLias on Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:31 pm

    they think that cause theres alot of "roboty" kinda utau out there without good oto files.

    auto tune is unripe doo-doo covered banana compared to utau

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:39 pm

    OK you guys I need to put my two cents, and it'll probably get a little ranty and long but here I go. XD

    First of all, there already seems to be a LOT of autotune hate in this thread. .__. Why do so many people hate autotune? Because it allows people without talent to get famous and sing?

    I have something to show you then.



    You mean to tell me that every single band and singer in this video is untalented and that because they use autotune, they're poopie?

    To look down on autotune is the same as looking down on UTAU -- while autotune is used obnoxiously by some rappers, that's because they're going for that EFFECT. However, autotune is USUALLY used to correct small errors in the singing -- you can't just sing like poopie and use autotune and sound godly, you have to have SOME sort of talent -- unless of course, you go for the T-Pain effect, in which case yes, the talentless have a means of sounding "good", but it's a fake effect.

    Bashing autotune is the same thing as bashing UTAU, because really, it is the very same thing.

    It doesn't matter how much work is put into making the voicebank, it doesn't matter how long it takes to make the .ust/whatever you need to do -- the concept is the same.

    You record yourself singing.
    A program corrects it and makes it sound good.

    Autotune and UTAU fulfill the same purpose.

    Oh, and for the record, autotune isn't something you can just walk right in and LOL CLICK A BUTTON AND YOU SOUND LIKE T-PAIN LOL :D -- or maybe I'm just doing it wrong. I myself HAVE and USE Antares Autotune and you have to do a LOT of fiddling with the settings to make sure autotune doesn't entirely screw up your notes all together.

    And for the record, the whole "UTAU lets you create a song from scratch" point -- how is that any different than singing yourself and adding autotune? Frankly doing the prior is a lot more work and 90% of the time, due to inexperience amongst the fandom, the latter will likely sound a lot better. .___.;;

    It isn't some ~miraculous~ thing that a program using RECORDED VOICE CLIPS can put together music -- that's exactly what autotune can be used to do, case in point, this song:



    They took a person's voice clips.
    They used autotune.
    They made a song out of it.

    THE EXACT.
    SAME.
    THING.
    THAT UTAU DOES.

    I think we need to step back and stop taking UTAU so seriously. .___.

    I get so irritated when people say LOL AUTOTUNE IS STOOPID without even realizing wtf they're talking about >__>

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by hello8bit on Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:46 pm

    I am not belittling Autotune, I was simply saying that it isn't the same thing. They have similarities, but they just aren't the same. uou

    And I own Autotune, it isn't just click a button and everything is Dandy. But it still isn't the equivalent of UTAU.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:49 pm

    No, it isn't the equivalent -- UTAU is autotune's ridiculously overcomplicated sibling.

    You can't say that UTAU is some high and mighty god tier program that shouldn't be compared to autotune because they do the EXACT SAME THING, except UTAU is a LOT more complicated, free, and GENERALLY, a lot worse sounding. .____.

    For example, if a person with no knowledge of either UTAU or Autotune were to try both methods of creating a song, I guarantee you that the Autotune version would not only be easier to carry out, but would also sound 100% better.

    Just because we put a lot of work into our UTAU doesn't mean that it's separated from what it is.

    It is autotune.

    It's as simple as that. .___.

    Just because we have extra time to sit here and make voicebanks and work on keeping them up to date and whatnot doesn't change the fact that both programs fulfill the exact same purpose .__.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by hello8bit on Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:54 pm

    scarfu wrote:No, it isn't the equivalent -- UTAU is autotune's ridiculously overcomplicated sibling.

    You can't say that UTAU is some high and mighty god tier program that shouldn't be compared to autotune because they do the EXACT SAME THING, except UTAU is a LOT more complicated, free, and GENERALLY, a lot worse sounding. .____.

    For example, if a person with no knowledge of either UTAU or Autotune were to try both methods of creating a song, I guarantee you that the Autotune version would not only be easier to carry out, but would also sound 100% better.

    Just because we put a lot of work into our UTAU doesn't mean that it's separated from what it is.

    It is autotune.

    It's as simple as that. .___.

    Just because we have extra time to sit here and make voicebanks and work on keeping them up to date and whatnot doesn't change the fact that both programs fulfill the exact same purpose .__.

    I don't want to sound rude, but you're the one getting riled up about this, not me. I never said any of those things, neither did I intend for my topic to be misconstrued in that way. I should have used a better word than "belittle", but my real point was that people don't understand the work one puts into UTAU. And that is what disappoints me. I guess I could have worded it better, and that's my bad, but I didn't mean to make you angry over it.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:57 pm

    ....?

    Riled up...?

    Not quite. XDDD

    I'm sorry if I appear that way, but I'm not...? XD I'm just using my debate voice... typing... .___. XD

    I'm just saying that we need to separate ourselves from any attachment to UTAU that we may have simply because we've spent time on it. People tend to do that a lot in this fandom I've noticed...

    For example, I've been attacked because I said that I believed VCV and banks other than CV are a waste of time (which was only an opinion btw), and really the only people who get worked up by that opinion are the people who spent their time working on the banks. So yes, I understand why they /would/ be upset that their hardwork wasn't appreciated, but it doesn't change the fact that to a lot of the world outside of VCV banks, they seem very unneccessary. XD

    This also applies to this situation -- I can understand why one would be upset that someone would belittle UTAU and call it autotune, but it doesn't change the fact that they both carry out the same duty. XD; It's not belittling at all to compare autotune to UTAU because they carry out the same purpose.

    That's the point I'm trying to make.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by hello8bit on Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:05 pm

    scarfu wrote:....?

    Riled up...?

    Not quite. XDDD

    I'm sorry if I appear that way, but I'm not...? XD I'm just using my debate voice... typing... .___. XD

    I'm just saying that we need to separate ourselves from any attachment to UTAU that we may have simply because we've spent time on it. People tend to do that a lot in this fandom I've noticed...

    For example, I've been attacked because I said that I believed VCV and banks other than CV are a waste of time (which was only an opinion btw), and really the only people who get worked up by that opinion are the people who spent their time working on the banks. So yes, I understand why they /would/ be upset that their hardwork wasn't appreciated, but it doesn't change the fact that to a lot of the world outside of VCV banks, they seem very unneccessary. XD

    This also applies to this situation -- I can understand why one would be upset that someone would belittle UTAU and call it autotune, but it doesn't change the fact that they both carry out the same duty. XD; It's not belittling at all to compare autotune to UTAU because they carry out the same purpose.

    That's the point I'm trying to make.

    You just seemed very angry at everyone in this topic. I get what you're saying, but I still don't view them as the same thing.

    Opinions are cool; no one's opinion is "right". I understand why you got upset when you felt Autotune was being attacked. Autotune does take time, and I appreciate it well enough. uou I just didn't appreciate how against my opinion you seemed. But it's alright, sometimes tone isn't well read over the internet.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:07 pm

    It's all good XDDD I've been told I'm a very pushy debater so I can see why it'd seem that way orz;; I apologize.

    Back on topic, I don't think it's neccessarily correct to insult other people's efforts, but comparing UTAU to autotune isn't incorrect, in my opinion. XD [/stops spamming the thread now =w=/]

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by Haloheroine on Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:10 pm

    Autotune is not the same.
    You sing, then tune it up.
    You cannot generate vocals without actually singing.
    . u.

    + her friend said T-pain effect, not Autotune itself. XD


    I know Autotune isn't really that derpily easy, but I just wanted to say that it's not the same.

    It's not actually voice synthesis. ^^''

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:14 pm

    ... They do the same thing. .___.

    If you take clips of someone singing or speaking and use autotune, you can create a song. (Double rainbow song/autotune the news/etc)

    If you take clips of someone singing or speaking and use UTAU, you can create a song.

    It's the same process. .___.

    I don't think it's correct to call UTAU or even Vocaloid a voice synthesizer by all technicalities but... .___. It's not synthetic -- it was created by a human being singing and then using a program to create music with it... .___.

    The only difference is that UTAU voicebanks can be distributed and the clips can be used to form different songs -- but Autotune can do the exact same thing. Put the clips from the double rainbow song into a new melody and you have a new song again. .___.

    I'm gonna stop posting in here though because it's obvious that this argument is a circular one and we're not going to be able to convince either side. XD;

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by LeLias on Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:17 pm

    its like apples and oranges...

    (Hey I liked ray william johnsons autotuned episode and double rainbow!, But in all honesty Im no fan of auto tune. It might just be me though, its been around for a long time).

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by zin on Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:09 pm

    i explain it that utau is like autotune but you always have the voice on file...

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by R.K. on Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:53 pm

    I think we should say Autotune and UTAU serve the same purpose, but they have somewhat different processes and elements...
    I mean...
    Are people that use Autotune represented by anime-like avatars? xDD Not... commonly, I would think...
    Are UTAUloids represented by real life people? I... wouldn't think so... -Tries to imagine a real life Teto and shuddercringes.-
    ^See, there's a DIFFERENCE, but they still serve the same purpose... having a machine/engine of some sort create pitches.
    Difficulty doesn't seem to relevant in my opinion here, since anything can be difficult depending on the user...
    And I really do agree with Zinfandel on this one.
    With UTAU, you have the voice ON file, as opposed to Autotune... But there's a similarity in the fact you can use voice-clips...

    Ultimately, I think your friend should have said,
    "It's LIKE using that T-Pain effect," because, really it is LIKE it... but it isn't... IT...
    Y'know?
    God, I'm dumb. xD

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:11 pm

    I said I wouldn't post in here again but damn it here I am. XD

    @RK: I don't think that's the point. XD; Like... in terms of what the program is, they are the same.

    The fandom that SURROUNDS the program has nothing to do with what the actual program's purpose is. XDD

    [/flees again ;D]

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by R.K. on Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:15 pm

    o3o; But... they're not exactly the same, are they?
    Didn't know Autotune was created by AquesTalk... or whatever. LOL. o3o;
    As I said, around the same, with differences... and the when I read 'Misunderstanding UTAU,' I take it as UTAU as a whole. The community and all.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by rokurin on Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:38 am

    I don't really think Autotune and UTAU can be considered the same...

    UTAU is practically a tool that helps you create a musical instrument [a voicebank] which can be later used by other people, like pianos, trumpets, etc. Remember, UTAU was devised to be like Vocaloid, which is, as stated by Yamaha, a musical instrument like any other musical instruments you own [the only difference is that it can 'talk', unlike your piano xDDDD]

    If you look at those autotuned songs [news, double rainbow, bed intruder], you can tell that Autotune doesn't have it's own 'voice', like an UTAU/Voclaoid/musical instrument. It just modifies existing sounds, it doesn't create them.

    That's also why I irk every time I see background stories/ personalities/ relationships in an UTAU's description. Wth man, when you buy a violin the seller doesn't start telling you that said violin likes strawberries and is a Beatles fan, does he? [/OFFTOPIC]

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by Noteloid on Sat Oct 09, 2010 5:49 am

    @rokurin Yes.UTAU is made to create and handle vocal instruments,and create singing,of course.But some people does not know what is an UTAUloid really,and this leads to a bunch of OCs and auto/pitchloids labelled as UTAUloids.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by hello8bit on Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:08 pm

    rokurin wrote:
    That's also why I irk every time I see background stories/ personalities/ relationships in an UTAU's description. Wth man, when you buy a violin the seller doesn't start telling you that said violin likes strawberries and is a Beatles fan, does he? [/OFFTOPIC]


    Really? I always find looking at the character designs the most fun! I think people do this because the instrument is a voice synth, and therefore with a voice comes a person. (In our case, UTAU) And even people out there have the tendency to give inanimate objects personal designs and personalities, as well as names and so forth.

    But if you don't like it, you don't have to create anything for yours. The beauty of having it as your own. :^)

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by BlazePyron on Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:01 pm

    I think the biggest difference between autotune and Utau is that with Utau you can take the same voice and change the lyrics. With autotune you're stuck with whatever lyrics you decided to sing.

    The technology is very similar, though, I will agree there.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by 산쇼씨 (Sansyo-ssi) on Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:52 am

    ... ...

    UTAU = Vocals Synthesis.

    Autotune = Vocals Editing.

    Autotune is for editing clips recorded by singers.
    UTAU is for creating vocals from virtual singers made by recording individual phonemes.

    A person can download UTAU and make vocals from scratch.
    A person can buysteal Autotune and then edit vocals they or someone else sings.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:21 am

    ... You can't make vocals from scratch in UTAU considering you need to record your own voice to make the voicebank.

    Just saying .__.;;;

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by 산쇼씨 (Sansyo-ssi) on Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:58 am

    ...Not every person who uses UTAU has to make their own voicebank. Voicebanks are publicly avaliable for use--

    But with autotune, you either have to record singing, or find a notillegal acapella to edit.

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    Re: Misunderstanding UTAU

    Post by scarfu on Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:59 am

    Or you can edit speaking clips, as proven by many of the parodies online nowadays (as I posted before, the double rainbow song, autotune the news series, etc.)

    You can autotune ANYTHING and make music out of it. XD;

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